Dear Kirk,
While I have enjoyed many wonderful encounters from this and related sites, ones that cater to an older/younger audience, I sometimes feel that I am either misleading or dishonest. Recently, I met a young man and we began an email conversation. He always referred to me in his mail as "sexy daddy" and we ultimately met. Now, I realize he only wanted a "daddy" type for play, nothing more and I can deal with that. Yet, I find I am not comfortable with the daddy label for myself even if it accurately describes who I am, especially in the eyes of the young.
I have many friends in long term relationships who are of the older/younger milieu and who are completely happy together. When I am around them, I sense how right they are for each other even when separated in age by 30 years or more. Nevertheless, I so often feel that I am not a real person in their eyes but one they have conjured up that suits their fantasies. In short, I don't need to be real---just OLD
I understand the attraction, the chemistry aspects of any sexual allure, and my fondness for younger guys never wavers. I would appreciate your thoughts and any suggestions of how I may alter my profile to be more accurate about my tastes. I tend to have a way with words---perhaps all the wrong ones!
Dear Uncomfortable Daddy,
Thanks for your astute and honest letter. Intergenerational dynamics are indeed complicated. Roles like daddy/boy, master/sub and man/puppy only scratch the surface. And there are lots of guys attracted to intergenerational mates who have no interest in any of these roles. There are lots of guys who have no interest in taking on family roles; there are guys who have no interest in being dominant or submissive. Some of us just like guys who are older or younger.
Online dating sites can be really helpful in matching people up with like-minded partners, but no matter how much information someone’s profile contains, a website is no replacement for an old-fashioned, honest to God conversation. When you meet someone from craigslist, you often get only a vague idea of who someone is. When you meet someone from a website, such as DaddyHunt, where they have set up a detailed profile with photographs and stats, it’s easy to fall under the illusion that you know more about them that you actually do.
I admire the men who want to have coffee first, but I must admit that when I’m looking for sex, I am usually too impulsive to go through that process. But it’s absolutely reasonable to want to have coffee first. Especially with intergenerational hookups, I think it’s crucial to have a phone conversation before making a date. Ask them what turns them on and what they’d like to get into. More importantly, get clear about what makes you tick and try to express that clearly. It’s not that you have to completely plan out your time together, but if you have two very different ideas about what’s going to happen, one of you might be disappointed.
When I first became an escort, clients always wanted to talk by phone before we met in person. It made them feel safer. These days, plenty of clients simply want to schedule by email. Our culture is changing in terms of how we communicate — we are doing more and more of our communication by email and text message. I would highly recommend talking by phone. Don’t wait until you’re at the point of giving someone your address. Think about having a conversation before you’ve made the decision to hook up. Really feel each other out. If you have more information going into your session, chances are better that you’ll both be satisfied.
I know I’ve called plenty of guys “Daddy” who didn’t have the slightest interest in hearing that word. Sometimes I just didn’t know, sometimes I was guessing that they wanted to hear it, sometimes I needed to say it. I’ve healed some of my emotional wounds with men I’ve called Daddy. But those experiences were often about my biological brothers and rarely about my father. We need a larger vocabulary!
When we have sex with someone, especially with someone we don’t know very well, we are engaging in wild guesswork. We project our fears and fantasies on someone. For instance, you play with a tall man and get triggered by memories of a mean vice principal. But in reality, the tall man doesn’t want to spank you with a paddle. You play with a redheaded married man and you’re filled with memories of the trucker who wouldn’t even look at you while you sucked him off. In reality, the married man wants nothing more than to kiss you and lick you from head to toe. Projections can be hot, but they can be prisons.
Have sex with the person you’re having sex with, not just the fantasies your mind is creating! That’s what porn is for.
It’s easy to feel used in the context of an intergenerational hookup. I know I’ve felt like guys were only interested in me for being younger. And I’ve definitely been interested in guys mostly because they were older. If we are to go deeper and learn from each other, we have to take our ages as a starting point of attraction, then go from there. We are complex people. There is room for people who fall outside all the stereotypes of older/younger men. We must make room for younger guys who have more money than their older partners. Younger tops! Older bottoms! Small-framed, boyish older men! 23 year-old daddies! Wise 30 year-olds! Dim-witted 65 year-olds! 28 year olds whose lives are on track! 55 year olds who are embroiled in silly drama! There is room for all of us.
We can all try and recognize the role we each play in perpetuating these intergenerational scripts. Daddyhunt gives us each a huge space in our profiles to articulate what we think, feel and seek. If we don’t use that space to put forward a more nuanced view of what we want, then people are going to fill in the gaps. Also, think about what message your pictures are sending. Something I’ve learned from escorting is that the types of images you use will determine what clients want from you. I’m not just talking about body parts. I’m talking about what’s in the background. Are you smiling? Are you trying to look gruffer than you really are? Are you hiding something or accentuating something? Use your photos and text to put forward as much about yourself as you’re comfortable with. Here’s the tricky part: the more specific you are, the less room there is for people to project their own fantasies onto you. You have to juggle saying what people want to hear versus what you want to say about yourself. By being more specific, you may make fewer connections. But I’d guess that the ones you do make will be higher quality. Like everything, it’s a tradeoff! Experiment with your profiles! Freshen them up every now and then!
Good luck!
Kirk
Kirk Read can be contacted at kirk@daddyhunt.com and welcomes letters seeking advice for this blog.
Wow! Kirk's put out a lot of
Wow! Kirk's put out a lot of invaluable information and has hit on all the important aspects of online dating IMO - good stuff.
He's also hinted at a generational reality older guys and younger guys really need to "get" ASAP: a couple of generations of gay men have shaped their sexuality on pornographic images and cultural flash points, and consequently have difficulty identifying their own authentic relationship needs. When a younger guy states he's looking for "maturity" he may actually be looking for an older dude who has enough self-honesty and experience to gain mature perspective and patiently work his way through any conflicts which arise between image-based relationships and those grounded in reality and personal authenticity.
A guys birth certificate (or his apparent age) IS merely an image-based attraction component but it doesn't sustain a long-term working relationship so we really need to see where our projections will possibly sabotage us eg if you're a control freak younger men may not actually be for you because they're quite uncontrollable...if you're looking for stability, wisdom and adulthood you may find a lot of older men to be quite damaged and very needy.
The 'net is a great place to articulate who you are and what you want, but it's only a couple of brief paragraphs which readers may or may not respond to. Even that can work for you or against you - luckily I hooked up with a DH guy just this week who's much cuter in real life than his pix, and much nicer than in his profile...turns out he was thinking the same thing about me!
This may just be a rephrasing
This may just be a rephrasing of what's already been said, but the two related aspects I would like to emphasize based upon my own experiences through DaddyHunt.com is first to have realistic expectations and second to avoid falling in love with one's personal fantasy. The men whom I have met and continue to meet through this website are generally older gentlemen with personal histories and extensive ranges of experience. In many cases, there are quite a number of men with whom they have had significant relationships over the years. All that means is that they weren't sitting still, letting life pass them by. All of these men are diverse combinations of personally desirable and undesirable qualities. None of these men are the embodiment of my personal fantasy, no matter how much they may initially seem to have in common with my ideal.
As much as I believe in the possibility of love at first sight, I know that building an ongoing relationship with someone is a very different thing that requires me to replace speculation with actual knowledge of who this man is, how he functions, how well he knows himself, and what he wants both in the bedroom and in every other area of his life. Considering the complexities and details that any single personality contains, it is perhaps a bit of a miracle when any two can share a space and form an ongoing close relationship. Because it does happen from time to time, however, we have every reason to hope that at some point this may happen to each one of us. In the meantime, there are many shorter seasons of love and friendship which can nevertheless also be a wondrous gift to our overall life experiences.
Metaphorically, we do not need to regard summer with disdain, simply because it only lasts a few months. If we allow it to be what it is and enjoy it as much as its characteristics and limitations will allow, we continue on through years and cycles with that many more pleasant memories to guide us. The wondrous invitation and reality is that there are many, many more beautiful summers of love to discover and one of them may even prove to be a love which lasts through the other seasons as well. Happy interpersonal adventures everyone! Hugs! --MountainPuppy
Hi Kirk, so happy to see
Hi Kirk, so happy to see you're doing this blog! I'm still in Key West. And even older than I was when we met ten years ago. I've lived several lives in that time too. But now and then I still write. Ed White will be here in a week so I'll ask him about Irving.
In the meantime please refer any nice young men to me. I won't pay them much attention but they're welcome to snuggle up with me at night.
Wallace and I talk about once a week. He's fine.
take care
W.
I'm 21 and live in Nairobi,
I'm 21 and live in Nairobi, Kenya. Like most of Africa and some other parts of the world, extremely conservative. Being gay is considered...well...insane. But I am gay. And I am here. The social situation here makes it really hard to meet people in the streets or in clubs or even in the park...there's not a single gay club in Nairobi by the way, just some gay-friendly clubs.
Point is, the easiest place one can meet a 'mate' for friendship or sex, the later being the most common sought after thing, is the internet. I've used DH for maybe a day before realizing that IP addresses from my region or something have been blocked for spamming or something of the sought. But I'm in another site and on reading your post, it got me thinking...why? That's one question that for some reason, when loging on to the site, I avoid. But, updated pictures, true description of myself, that's the most important thing. Most of the people...well actually all the guys I've dated are at much older than I. wouldn't want to give false expectations.
Someone once asked me why I'm attracted to older men...the only answer I could give is that I just am. Does anyone here have a concrete reason for their preference in terms of age...which by the way, once I'm told, I forget. It's just a number. It's the person's personality I get attracted to. I just answered the question, didn't I?
My own views about
My own views about intergenerational romance are as follows:
As I crossed the threshold age of 50, I almost suddenly became physically attracted to very young guys 30 years my junior.
I think it had something to do with really seeing my mortality closing in and perhaps realizing that I would never have a biological son.
It is great to be around someone who is always enthusiastic and to whom everything is new. And to be honest it is great to be around someone who is physically fresh and new.
That being said, and having had several relationships from one year and a half up to more than ten years, after time passes, the exact same factors and issues come into play whether my partner is my age or 30 years younger.
I think that at the end of the day, every person is different and therefore, every couple's dynamics are different and it is impossible to make any generalizations based solely on age.
I agree with the initial
I agree with the initial comment. I have never been good at role playing. In the revolutionary gay world I came out into (1969), the great thing about being gay is that we didn't have to play roles (and this includes the Top-Bottom labels, by the way -- we looked at them as remnants of the 1950s and ideas like "Which one is the girl?").
I see a great deal of beauty in older-younger dynamics, but just being a role is to me very constricting. I feel as if I don't need to be there -- anyone could substitute for me. And strangely, after such encounters I feel that I have been the one being used for my age (rather than the other way around).
The only way I know to overcome this dynamic is to hold fast to my love for my gay tribe and to keep as an absolute article of faith that the gay soul is one of the most glorious things in creation -- and that every gay person has a great gay soul, even if it is covered over and needs some excavation to find.
Why is Edmund White's name
Why is Edmund White's name being bandied about so much here? Does he have shares in Daddyhunt? I think we should be told.
thats nothin -I've had
thats nothin -I've had Tennesee Williams (he wasn't much good but what the hell he was famous).
What?
What?
oops that was meant for the
oops that was meant for the "Ed" White blog!
I can be contacted at
I can be contacted at oluoch@gmail.com
Someone please tell me why we've been blocked from using Daddyhunt. It's basically the best there is.
And yes. Role playing and labels are not right. They break down the very essence of relationships...being with someone for who they are and not what they are...
In my 15 years of being "Out"
In my 15 years of being "Out" (I'm 30 now, you do the math) I have mainly dated guys who were 18-25 years older than me. When I first came out in a small city, other guys my age were still closeted, so older men were my role models, friends and sexualy available. I belive that we are "Imprinted" during puberty by our main sexual desire. Mine was my coaches and teachers.
As an adult I have a Daddy. A man 18 years my senior. Funny enough he identifies as a "Boy" and has a "Daddy" himself. I've often been told that when I'm older I will make someone a great daddy as well. I can only hope.
What do I get out of the relationship?.... I have a wonderful man who I love and that loves me. I have someone to look up to, give me advice. He is calm, not into head games, patient. He listens to me, is gental, but not afraid to disagree with me or let me know when I am wrong. Oh, and he is great in bed as many older gay men tent to be after all that practice.
What does he get? I'm not sure really. I know he is happy. It's not that I don't care, just that I don't live in his head so can't speak for him.
One theory I have about this attraction (This is based on my own experience) is that "Being Gay" is a culture we are introduced to as adults, not one we are born into. Our parents and community teach us our own culture, but untill we come out to ourselves we don't start to learn about our connection to "Gay Culture." Older Gay men in my life have been valuable role models. Asking my Mom and Dad about what to do about crabs, or the creepy man at the Y that was stocking me was not an option, but, I got great advice from my older male friends and lovers.
I have heard it expressed from some of my Daddy friends, that because they never had children there is a desire to have a paternal connection with the younger generation. I have also had men in my life that were gay father figures and the relationships were non-sexual.
I'm not sure if I have cast any light on the subject, but hope my perspective may be of use to someone
Very informative and
Very informative and enlightening website.
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